Electronic locomotive whistle

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doctorb5
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Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Wed May 01, 2002 1:33 pm

I'd like to make an electronic steam train whistle for a project that I have. I have looked around and found "sound on chip" solutions that do not work exactly as I'd like. Specifically, I'd like to have more control over the duration of the sound than those chips provide. What I envision is a whistle that will "blow" as long as the operator has his finger on the button. The sound should start as soon as you press the button, and last until you release the button. *Ideally*, the sound would have 3 parts: Attack, sustain (as long as the button is pressed), and decay (when the button is released). But I would settle for less...<p>I have looked at using one of the recordable chips made by ISD, but I believe that once you start playing a recorded sound, the sound continues whether or not you are holding the "PLAY" button. (In this case the sound would of course be limited to 10 or 15 seconds, but that's close enough to "unlimited" for my needs.)<p>The solution needs to work on 12 volts or less and be "simple enough" and of course economical. It needs to output an audio signal that would feed an standard audio amp. I could use NE 555's or even 16F84's if I had to. I've even thought of using an endless tape (like the ones made for answering machines) and simply vary the speed of the players' motor with some sort of DC controller. This would sort of vary the frequency of the sound depending on the operator's action on a potentiometer.<p>Any help or suggestion would be appreciated.

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Chris Smith
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Chris Smith » Wed May 01, 2002 2:59 pm

Assuming they are still around the # SN76477N and the # SN76488N "complex sound generators" should do the Job?

doctorb5
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Thu May 02, 2002 8:40 am

Thanks for the info. I did a quick search on Digikey's site and was not successful. Any other sources? Also, I've never played with those chips. Do they come with some kind of docs? or would you have a sample application or a link to a project utilizing the chips?<p>Thanks. :)

keymaker
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by keymaker » Thu May 02, 2002 9:16 am

I've seen jap cars with the light that fades out<p>Maybe you could use something like that!<p>
OR use a dimmer switch type thing and you can alter the frequency on demand... Imagine how cool that would be<p>You could make it go:
WWHOOOOOO WOOWOOWOOW WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO<p>
And you could add static noise somehow to make it sound like a running train<p>
And play it like an instrument!!

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Chris Smith
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Chris Smith » Thu May 02, 2002 1:43 pm

If they are available, they come with full docs. I'll look up the master catalog and see if they are still around. I also have some docs on the unit, for a whistle, train sounds, and a few other projects.

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Chris Smith
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Chris Smith » Thu May 02, 2002 4:02 pm

I cant locate these older chips but if you investigate the Yamaha site as well as these two complex sound generators, they might solve your problem. These are available as well as more advanced units. Yamaha part # YMU 759 and FB-01. <p>I didn't have time to investigate these but there are many others under the label of "Complex Sound Generators"<p> Start with:<p> http://www.modcan.com/modhtml/modules.html <p>OR <p>Complex Sound Generators<p>OR <p>Yamaha web site<p>All of the newer ones are light years above the ones I mentioned earlier. There are kit forms for experimental, and fully assembled units. Its been a while since I played around with sound generators but a musician friend of mine tells me how advanced the Yamaha units have become, taking over the market.

doctorb5
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Fri May 03, 2002 1:22 pm

Thanks Chris. The Yamaha chips look very nice, but out of my budget. On the other hand, I've found the SN9428 on the RadioShack site. Maybe I can still find it on the Net. :)

James Cart
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by James Cart » Fri May 03, 2002 5:36 pm

I made a several different police sirens with switch inputs using an Atmel 2343, 8 pin microcontroller. I used BASCOM basic language to create the sounds, it took about an hour. Bascom is free, the tones were very good.
Total cost was about $3.00 for the chip. If your into microcontrollers this is a easy cheap solution for creating tones.
James

bodgy
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by bodgy » Fri May 03, 2002 11:40 pm

Think I might have found what you are looking for. Train sound FX kit available from Jaycar Electronics, www.jaycar.com.au .The webpage is always slow to load. The kit part No:. KJ-8086
Runs off 12V DC includes PCB and components oh yes A$19.95 er about U$10.00.<p>bodgy
On a clear disk you can seek forever.

doctorb5
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Mon May 06, 2002 7:55 am

Those are great suggestions! Thanks.<p>- James: I thought of that too, but I am not very good at audio theory. You see, I can easily make a "European" steam whistle. Those are high-pitch, single-tone whistles. You can even make a simple one with an NE555. On the other hand, American steam whistles are made up of 3 or 4 different tones and are much lower and deeper. I don't know how to simulate the multiple tones (frequencies) with a PIC. (If you do, let me know :) )<p>- Bodgy: I have contacted the tech support people for that web site. I basically asked them if that was a European or American whistle... If it works the way I want, that would be my solution!<p>Thanks again to both of you.

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Edd
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Edd » Thu May 09, 2002 4:21 pm

Years ago I helped my son on a sound simulation
project and we used the TI SN76477 complex sound
generator i.c. I remember it also giving the info
on the data sheets for a steam locomotive/engine
and whistle simulation on ~pg 12 of the data sheet. Even producing the sound of the speeding up of the engine. The sounds parameters were determined by off chip R and C components. Seems like I remember sustain-attack-decay programmability in the same manner.Its still available, and only $7 from :
www.bgmicro.com/
If you go to their "links" page and find tech
doc on the end you can D/L the 15 page data/AN
on the unit.In the D/L catalog its on the first
of the page index of parts ~pg 4
Hope this might offer yet another possibility.
73's de Edd
;)<p>[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Edd Whatley ]</p>

doctorb5
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Mon May 20, 2002 5:46 am

Well, it's been 2 weeks and I haven't heard anything from that Australian company about their whistle. I guess it wasn't what I needed... :( <p>On the other hand, I have found a site that describes an algorithm to get sound from a PIC using a 1-bit technique. You can even download a DOS program that will encode WAV files for you (PICSOUND.ZIP).<p>Sounds promising…<p>[ May 20, 2002: Message edited by: doctorb5 ]</p>

Timothy Rasch
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Timothy Rasch » Fri Jun 07, 2002 8:59 pm

I have seen discrete transistor circuits in Popular Electronics in the 1970-1980 era on steam whistles. I will research my old magazines for you . please give me your email address and a couple of days for research. I can scan schematic and entire article and send it to you. please email me at [email protected] Glad to help,
Timothy Rasch in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

Timothy Rasch
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by Timothy Rasch » Fri Jun 07, 2002 11:12 pm

Hi again.You don't need a sophisticated micro circuit to generate a steam whistle .It uses 3 2n2712 transistors. You can use nte85,nte199.Select noize transistor for smoothest or best noize. I have found this article in Popular Electronics May 1972 pg51,52,53.I have saved the pages to hardrive.Please reply with your email address.
I may build the circuit myself to find out how it sounds. I have a pipe organ music file that I downloaded that has the train whistle in it. It's called "Beyond The Blue Horizon" By Ogden [email protected] Timothy Rasch

doctorb5
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Re: Electronic locomotive whistle

Post by doctorb5 » Fri Jun 14, 2002 7:59 am

I can't thank you enough Tim!!! This is exactly what I've been looking for. Thanks also for your help via email. :)

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