Price too high for four channel AD chip???

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MrAl
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Price too high for four channel AD chip???

Post by MrAl »

Hi there,

Recently i offered a four channel AD chip that interfaces directly
to the computer in that nothing else is required to use it with
the computer (free software comes with it) except a few cheap
1/4 or 1/8 watt resistors. This isnt a business thing really
though it's more that i want people to have a low cost way of
testing their batteries, especially their NiMH cells, so that more
people will be able to tell if the big battery companies are not
producing the cells to the standards that they advertise (capacity
ratings). I only ask for $4.50 for one chip and it only takes
about another dollar or two to get it working with a computer
serial port and the software is pretty nice too, and can work with
cheap thermistors quite easily.

The thing is, some people i tell about this say "oh yeah send me one
and that price cant be beat" but then other people i talk to and tell
about this never seem to get back to me :smile:

So i have to wonder, does this seem like too high a price?
I have to do quite a bit to the chip before it can be used, like
calibrate the clock, program it, test each channel, package it,
and take it to the post office (they pay for postage too though).
I also dont get the raw chips free either of course.

What do you think? Price too high? People dont want to be bothered?
Other?
LEDs vs Bulbs, LEDs are winning.
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jwax
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Post by jwax »

I'd like to hear more about it, MrAl!
Are you talking about a battery discharge monitor/logger?
Or charge rate/logger? Both?
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MrAl
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Post by MrAl »

hi again,

Haha, this wasnt meant to be an 'advertising' thread or anything,
but yes, it's a logger and charge monitor. I'll tell you more in a PM
as i dont want to misuse this thread. I was hoping to hear opinions
about what other people think is a fair price for chips like these.

I ran into other problems too, such as shipping fees. First, the
padded envelope ended up costing another dollar so i lost money
on that for each chip sent, and i found out to ship to Australia using
USPS costs $7.20 just for first class! Geeze, that's more than the
darn chip.
LEDs vs Bulbs, LEDs are winning.
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haklesup
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Post by haklesup »

MrAl, I don't think the price is too high for small quantity. And as you know, shipping is a killer for low volume, low cost items anyway. I think what you see is the nature of sales for your niche.

I suggest you put more with it and raise the price. A $20 to $50 kit with a project or two, a demo/evaluation board and several chips might be more attractive to DIY hobbiests. As you know, the PCB or substrate you assemble these circuits on is often the bottleneck between a schematic and an actual finished project. People pay more for knowledge these days than they do for hardware very often.

I think if you subtly posted a few keywords that allow me to find your site, that would not be anything like posting a link and a buy here button.
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MrAl
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Post by MrAl »

Hi again,

haklesup:
Oh yeah that's an interesting idea. I did check to see what boards
would cost to make but im not sure if i want to go that route or not
yet.
Also, i found i have a lot of trouble with getting the correct information
on the phone too which relates to what i tell a possible 'customer'.
For example, i called the local post office and they said priority to
Au was 7.20, then i find out that that was for First class on the web,
then i go to the post office and they tell me it's $1.70 !!!
I already told the person to send 7.20 for shipping and it's not easy
to refund money to a foreign country (it's not the exchange rate, but
the typical fee to convert AUD to USD which at my bank is 75 freekin
dollars! ha ha). I ended up sending it Priority which is 11 dollars, so
i lost money there too.
Interestingly, when i called the bank THREE TIMES i got a different
answer for the fee to convert money from AUD to USD:
1. First call: 2 percent of face value
2. Second call: you'll have to call back because the foreign office isnt open.
3. Third call: 15 dollars flat
4. Visit to bank: 75 dollars for a check, 40 dollars wired.

BTW 1,2,3 were all on the same day.

It seems that people on the phone say anything they want too.
LEDs vs Bulbs, LEDs are winning.
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jwax
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Post by jwax »

If you're going international, PayPal is the way to go, Al!
They do the best rates exchange for you, and their cost is minimal.
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MrAl
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Post by MrAl »

Hi again,

jwax:
With Paypal can they take money out of your bank account without
your approval?
LEDs vs Bulbs, LEDs are winning.
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haklesup
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Post by haklesup »

With Paypal can they take money out of your bank account without
your approval?
No they cannot and I have had an account for years with no problem at all, I have also accepted international sales. Rather than refund, with paypal you just finish the transaction then send cash back to the sender in a seperate transaction. Just like most credit cards, they will protect you against fraudulant payments including unauthorized withdrawals. If you feel OK with online banking with your regular institution, this is just as safe. Now if you distrust online banking, thats another story.

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/websc ... nds-policy

2 layer boards in Qty 50 should be very cheap per piece. Lots of PCB fabs have online quote calculators so you can do some what-ifs without getting formal quotes.

Intenational customers are used to paying lots for shipping. Noone expects you to loose money. First class is fine in most cases. Priority mail flat rate envelope would make it easier to estimate shipping even though it cost a bit more and may be larger than necessary
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jwax
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Post by jwax »

I agree with haklesup on PayPal. You can send cash to another PayPal member for 1%, send/receive invoices, and transfer funds, just like any bank. Plus, they pay dividends on your cash balance of something like 5%. Better than a checking account, and better than most savings accounts.
They also offer a line of credit, once you're known to them.
One thing more- their customer service, to resolve issues, are top notch.
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Post by smariotti »

haklesup wrote:2 layer boards in Qty 50 should be very cheap per piece. Lots of PCB fabs have online quote calculators so you can do some what-ifs without getting formal quotes.
I've never sent anything out to be fabbed, but I look foward to doing so once I'm more confident in my designs.

This may be a useful resource if you're shopping around:

http://www.ladyada.net/library/pcb/costcalc.html

I've punched in a few numbers and poked around a bit. I don't think they're listed on there, but a lot of people have sung the praises of "Gold Phoenix" in terms of price/features, though I believe they're the "email-them-the-gerber-files" variety of service, and don't have a full service website to speak of.
Robert Reed
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Post by Robert Reed »

jwax wrote:I agree with haklesup on PayPal. You can send cash to another PayPal member for 1%, send/receive invoices, and transfer funds, just like any bank. Plus, they pay dividends on your cash balance of something like 5%. Better than a checking account, and better than most savings accounts.
They also offer a line of credit, once you're known to them.
One thing more- their customer service, to resolve issues, are top notch.
I was very reluctant to enrol in Pay Pal at first, but have since found them to be a sound institution with almost foolproof security. And as J-Wax said with a 5% return I can't get that on even the best of CDs today. I generally keep a slush fund of $500 to $1000 in it just to cover my half dozen E-Bay dealings a year Quickly. Now I love it.And the interest earned in that time usually covers my E-Bay fees. The one thing I do not understand is that they have a small charge to deposit money into my account and nothing to remove it. Just the opposite of what one would think. But their greatest asset is that you can actually talk to a real human being about your concerns almost any hour of the day and in my experience have been most helpful and knowledgeable.
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jwax
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Post by jwax »

That's the first I heard of a deposit fee, Robert!
Sorry here MrAl to be off topic!
I don't get charged for a bank to PayPal deposit, it just takes 3-4 business days. No charge for deposits. They also provide a no-fee MasterCard ATM card to access my account.
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Post by Robert Reed »

I probably should have clarified that a little bit. Personal bank account transfers to Pay Pal account have no fee. It is only when a buyer deposits payment to that account for a sale is when I am charged. I sort of relate this to when you do business with commercial establishments with VISA that they(the seller) pay a 3% charge for that transaction. All and all, the speed and convenience is still worth the small fee when doing E-Bay business.
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MrAl
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Post by MrAl »

Hi again,

Well everyone here seems to like Paypal i guess?
So it wont hurt you to give them your bank account to do business
with them then?
LEDs vs Bulbs, LEDs are winning.
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Post by Engineer1138 »

I have a PayPal Pro account but I opened a specific bank account just for them (checking acounts are free, so why not). Never had any trouble with them and it lets me take credit card payments. My wife's small business did have one problem where PP double billed one of her customers and then took 90 days to credit the money back, so she was out that money until they finished their "investigation."

As far as the chip goes, $4.50 is peanuts for that kind of functionality. I'm guessing that the market for such an item is pretty small.

I also built a battery charger/load tester a few years ago but never marketed it because it looked like it would take forever to make my money back after investing in a nice PCB, enclosure, writing logging software, instruction manual, etc.
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