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 Post subject: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 9:32 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 4:17 pm
Posts: 1247
This is down right StRaNgE. :?

The two Hard Drives I tested with Spinrite 6, and with Seatools don't show any errors. :?

The one drive {HITACHI HDE721010SLA330} 12/2009, has stopped clicking, and seems to be operating just fine. :?
The {Seagate Barracuda ST31000333AS} 02/15/2009, continues to run quiet, and no errors are showing up. :?

I sent off a e-mail to Gibson Research Corporation{Makers of Spinrite 6}, and asked why I'm not getting any reports of bad sectors, or corrupt data blocks.

Well......
Sometime around 2008 to 2009 HDD Manufacturers started installing a self-correcting software in the HDD's firmware.
It senses the bad sector area, then moves the data off of the bad sector area, locks the bad sector area off, then hides it from the drive table, so it can't be used.
{Note: Spinrite 6 was released in 2004.}

Now Spinrite 6 use to see these bad sector areas, and would check them down to the (L)ow (L)evel (F)ormat.
If the the sector was only corrupted, it would repair the LLF, and return the sector back to normal operation.
If the bad sector could not be recovered, it stayed locked off.

Because of this firmware change to the HDD's, Spinrite can't show the locked bad sectors. :x

The SeaTools is a 2011 Version, but it too does not see bad locked sectors.

Okay, So here is the question........

Is there Hard Drive testing software out there that gets around this issue of the hiding of bad sectors?


Signed: Janitor Tzap


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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 10:56 am 
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Location: USA / North Carolina / Fayetteville
question about a BAD SECTOR, is it actually corrupted info or physical damage ?
if it is just bad info,,is it like a 0 where a 1 should be or what ? what makes a bad NON DAMAGED SECTOR ?

and if it is a physical, how is it possible to make a damage in that exact spot with out damaging the rest of the disk ?

just some random thoughts for any HD expert out there..


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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 4:41 pm 
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dacflyer wrote:
question about a BAD SECTOR, is it actually corrupted info or physical damage ?
if it is just bad info,,is it like a 0 where a 1 should be or what ? what makes a bad NON DAMAGED SECTOR ?
and if it is a physical, how is it possible to make a damage in that exact spot with out damaging the rest of the disk ?

just some random thoughts for any HD expert out there..

Here's some good information from wikipedia on Hard disk drive failure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_disk_drive_failure


Signed: Janitor Tzap


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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 1:21 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 1736
Location: Mideast USA
Hi JanTzap. Sent you a message...



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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:18 am 
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Location: San Jose CA
bad sectors are really magnetic domains that either won't flip or revert to another state on their own. There does not need to be any physical damage to the area, it could be a completely random phenomenon minimized with good processing. If the firmware on the HDD denies a sector exist, there is no software level tool to make it visible, one would need to revert the firmware or use a proprietary tool the HDD maker does not release. Be happy, they work


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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:39 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 4:17 pm
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UPDATE:

I still haven't found any software that will allow direct access to the Hard Drive Controls and Firmware,
to attempt recovery of locked off sectors on a hard drive. :(

The best I could find was a tool in SpeedFan that checks the SMART of your hard drive and gives you the current heath of the drive, and can perform a more in depth online check of the hard drive's condition.
You can download the latest Version from here: http://filehippo.com/download_speedfan/

Which is nice, if you suspect the drive is acting strangely, and want to confirm its condition. :wink:

SpeedFan also has Monitoring;
Fan Speeds & Controls
Voltages
Temperatures
{Note: You will need to set it up for your Mother Board, after you install it.}

These are nice to check too, when you think there is a problem with your computer. :wink:


Signed: Janitor Tzap


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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2006 7:11 pm
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Location: Maryland
Nothing malicious is intended, but I guess I am not understanding why a bad sector is that important.
Regardless of the reason, hard or soft error, with the size and current cost of drives, is it worth dealing with it.

Now, if bad sectors are increasing that is certainly a bad sign that the drive is in trouble, and should probably be replaced.
If that interest is a purely an educational issue, well that changes the game.

BTW: Years go I used Norton Disk Doctor. If anyone remembers that software suite, It still pops up on Google, but it's dated 1988 :shock:



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 Post subject: Re: Hard Drive Testing............
PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:00 pm 
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Lenp wrote:
Nothing malicious is intended, but I guess I am not understanding why a bad sector is that important.
Regardless of the reason, hard or soft error, with the size and current cost of drives, is it worth dealing with it.

Now, if bad sectors are increasing that is certainly a bad sign that the drive is in trouble, and should probably be replaced.
If that interest is a purely an educational issue, well that changes the game.
I worked with MFM, RLL, IDE & SCSI Hard Drives, and soft formatting errors were a common issue.
{This was due to power fluctuations in the PSU's, and sudden power losses or spikes while the drive was writing}
Thus, having programs like Spinrite that were able to repair the corrupted sector formatting, and make it use able again.
Were great, considering what hard drives were costing back then.
Also, you could look at the bad sector map on the drive, and compare it to the recent drive test that was done.
And you could quickly see if the bad sectors were getting bigger, thus a sure sign the drive was failing.

But, yeah......
With the price of HDD's being as low as they are now.
It doesn't seem worth the effort of messing with a Drive.
Unless it is part of an obsolete system that can't be upgraded to use newer OS's or components.
Lenp wrote:
BTW: Years go I used Norton Disk Doctor. If anyone remembers that software suite, It still pops up on Google, but it's dated 1988 :shock:
Yeah, I used Norton Disk Doctor, it was a great tool for fixing floppies.

But, when FAT 32, then NTFS came out, it would not work on them.


Signed: Janitor Tzap


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